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Dejach Aklilu
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Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 12:32

The regions of Humera, Tsegede, Welkait and other territories found to the west of River Tekeze upto the Sudan border were awarded to Tigray region by EPRDF. Before that, they were part of Begemedir/Gonder province. According to EPRDF this action was justified because of claims these areas taken off Tigray province and awarded to Begemedir in the beginning of the 1940s by Emp. Haile-silassie, as a punishment for a southern Tigrayan rebellion that occurred during that era against the emperor. So the logical question to ask is, do maps drawn before 1940s(before the first Woyane rebellion took place and Haile-silassie's presumed "theft" of Tigrayan lands) show the region to the west of River Tekeze as part of Tigray?

Pre-1940 Administrative maps of Ethiopia/Abyssinia

Map 1: It's a map drawn by the Italians in 1936 when they surveyed their new occupied country and drew administrative provinces not just for Ethiopia but the whole of East Africa. Notice how the lands to the west of the River Tekeze is part of the Itaian Amhara province. While Tigray was administered as one unit with a province called "Eritrea".

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 12:38

Map 2: This is another Italian map drawn in 1911. This is an important map because, it not only shows the provincial boundaries of the whole country, it also tells us who was ruling which province. Once again, a map drawn before the claimed "theft" took place, shows that the land to the west of River Tekeze was part of Begemedir province, ruled by Ras Wolde-Giyorgis.

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 12:46

Map 3: This is a German map drawn in 1903. Again, a historical map drawn by a neutral body shows the province of Tigray was bounded by River Tekeze.

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Dejazmch of Tigrai
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejazmch of Tigrai » 26 Oct 2013, 12:54

Since when did Tigray was named "Eritrea" and made part of Eritrea? just b/c Italians drew some temporary map for a brief period of 4 years doesn't mean it reflected true historical territorial integrity of the respective Ethiopian society.

All welkait, humera, tsegede, tselemet, sekota, kobbo, parts of Semien and of course the entire afar was part and parcel of the different provinces of the tigrian people, thus the true ownership of the probivince of Tigray.

Remember tigray existed as a political entity holding equally autonomous provinces but they all were tigrians meaning were ethnic tigrians, for example welkait, tsegede, was known as provinces, but the people spoke tigringa and were ethnic tigrians, same with Enderta province, Tembien, Shire, A-game, and the many sub provinces, but they were all ethnic tigrians. Thus, you have no claim over any of our people's rightful territory.

Centeral afar was solen from Enderta, parts of northern afar stolen from Kilete awelalo and parts of southern afar stolen from Raya azebo in 1995, which I think is the greatest blunder to the people of southern TIGRAY.

Tigray still remains the looser, TPLF did return the stolen territories of the people of tigray but it also gave away the entire centeral, parts of north afar and southern afar to the 1 million nomad afars who have no ownership what so ever.

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Akele » 26 Oct 2013, 13:06

southern afar to the 1 million nomad afars who have no ownership what so ever.

I am shocked by the statement above, can you pls explain what you mean? the ancient historic afars are native to the land hence how can you as a tigrian claim their land. explain why the afars are not owners of their land?

why fight with every one over lands that doesn't belong to you? you are holding Eritrean badme, claiming afar lands, amhara lands lol. whats next?
Last edited by Akele on 26 Oct 2013, 13:08, edited 1 time in total.

Halafi Mengedi
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Halafi Mengedi » 26 Oct 2013, 13:08

Ye Mayafr Leba,

How long did take you to photo shop the map???
Your fathers took them fater time to loot Tigray lands than to photo shop your wishful lands.

What the hell were your fathers thinking to name Tigrigna name of Adi Arkay and Mai Xebri to the region they do not understand one word of Tigrigna???

Did Aba Dula teach you any 'Gebre gebnet at all when you were youth???

Dejazmch of Tigrai
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejazmch of Tigrai » 26 Oct 2013, 13:24

Akele,

The entire centeral afar was part of Enderta until 1995 so was parts of southern afar part of raya-azebo and parts of northern afar parts of kilete awelaleo. By the way as we speak there are substantial tigrians working and living in Afar, there are also a lot of them who live in both dergajen and afar.

Some historical review,

Notable hereditary chiefs of Endertan who held the office and the title of Be'al Gada (governor of the salt mining districts of central afar) in the last 200 years.

Be'al Gada Weldu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Amdemikael (Ras)
Be'al Gada Kifleyesus (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Woldeslelassie ( Re'se reusan Woldselassie the great)
Be'al Gada Debbeb (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Minasse (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Sibhatu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Araya (Ras)
Be'al Gada Abraha (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Tedla (Aba Guben) (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Weres (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Kahsa (Dej.)
Akele wrote:
southern afar to the 1 million nomad afars who have no ownership what so ever.

I am shocked by the statement above, can you pls explain what you mean? the ancient historic afars are native to the land hence how can you as a tigrian claim their land. explain why the afars are not owners of their land?

why fight with every one over lands that doesn't belong to you? you are holding Eritrean badme, claiming afar lands, amhara lands lol. whats next?

Halafi Mengedi
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Halafi Mengedi » 26 Oct 2013, 13:42

Akele wrote:
southern afar to the 1 million nomad afars who have no ownership what so ever.

I am shocked by the statement above, can you pls explain what you mean? the ancient historic afars are native to the land hence how can you as a tigrian claim their land. explain why the afars are not owners of their land?

why fight with every one over lands that doesn't belong to you? you are holding Eritrean badme, claiming afar lands, amhara lands lol. whats next?
Afar region is the Afar land the Tigray part and the Eritrean part but the Tigray part was designated as Afar Kilil for the residents in the region. Part of it was under Enderta Awraja kilil like the Agew Sokota was part of Tembien Abergele, this took place after 1991 but the entire Afar is Tigray anyone because the Amhara refused to grant the Agew Amhara their own Kilil. Afar should be part of Tigray and Sokota should be part of Tigray as well. 80% of the entire Afar people live in the Ethiopian side and 20% live in the Eritrean side for now and they will join as part of Tigray all in the near future.

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Halafi Mengedi » 26 Oct 2013, 14:15

Dejazmch of Tigrai wrote:Akele,

The entire centeral afar was part of Enderta until 1995 so was parts of southern afar part of raya-azebo and parts of northern afar parts of kilete awelaleo. By the way as we speak there are substantial tigrians working and living in Afar, there are also a lot of them who live in both dergajen and afar.

Some historical review,

Notable hereditary chiefs of Endertan who held the office and the title of Be'al Gada (governor of the salt mining districts of central afar) in the last 200 years.

Be'al Gada Weldu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Amdemikael (Ras)
Be'al Gada Kifleyesus (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Woldeslelassie ( Re'se reusan Woldselassie the great)
Be'al Gada Debbeb (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Minasse (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Sibhatu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Araya (Ras)
Be'al Gada Abraha (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Tedla (Aba Guben) (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Weres (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Kahsa (Dej.)
Akele wrote:
southern afar to the 1 million nomad afars who have no ownership what so ever.

I am shocked by the statement above, can you pls explain what you mean? the ancient historic afars are native to the land hence how can you as a tigrian claim their land. explain why the afars are not owners of their land?

why fight with every one over lands that doesn't belong to you? you are holding Eritrean badme, claiming afar lands, amhara lands lol. whats next?
Defchach Amharay,

Did your mother ever tell you "NEWRI EYU kEMZI AYBAHALN" cut your lie after lie we are very tiered of you because of :

1. Afar is not Enderta land no Enderta Tigray ethnic owned the land, it belongs to the Afar people but their administration was in Enderta Awraja therefore, you do not have anything to claim in Afar as Tigrayan ethnic. The same is true for the Agew in Tembien, the Kunama in Shire and the Irob in Aggammee, the land is theirs and the Tigrayan ethnics do not have anythign to claim except those ethnics are part of Tigray administation and they are part of Tigray.

2. The people you mentioned above there was no single person whether Enderta or Afar called Dejazmach or Ras. This is part of your imaginary fabrication something never ever existed.

Dejazmch of Tigrai
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejazmch of Tigrai » 26 Oct 2013, 14:25

Retardo, Brother of Saya abrish, the dogg of shewa hooligans,

You better defend welkai and tselemet, the Gonderians are coming into your territory, do you have what it takes to defend it? please leave afar to us, we will get it back once we demolish the ethnic based kilil system, leave Afar to us and focus on defending tselemet, humera and tsegede.

Following the foot steps of our heroic fore-fathers

Notable hereditary chiefs of Endertan who held the office and the title of Be'al Gada (governor of the salt mining districts of central afar) in the last 200 years.

Be'al Gada Weldu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Amdemikael (Ras)
Be'al Gada Kifleyesus (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Woldeslelassie ( Re'se reusan Woldselassie the great)
Be'al Gada Debbeb (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Minasse (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Sibhatu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Araya (Ras)
Be'al Gada Abraha (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Tedla (Aba Guben) (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Weres (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Kahsa (Dej.)

CDE
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by CDE » 26 Oct 2013, 14:37

Dejach Aklilu wrote: ...While Tigray was administered as one unit with a province called "Eritrea".

Image
Thank goodness, this old map of Eritrea didn't materialized. Living together with [email protected]@@me? :roll: :roll: :roll:

Dejach Aklilu
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 14:39

Dejazmch of Tigrai wrote:Retardo, Brother of Saya abrish, the dogg of shewa hooligans,

You better defend welkai and tselemet, the Gonderians are coming into your territory, do you have what it takes to defend it? please leave afar to us, we will get it back once we demolish the ethnic based kilil system, leave Afar to us and focus on defending tselemet, humera and tsegede.

Following the foot steps of our heroic fore-fathers

Notable hereditary chiefs of Endertan who held the office and the title of Be'al Gada (governor of the salt mining districts of central afar) in the last 200 years.

Be'al Gada Weldu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Amdemikael (Ras)
Be'al Gada Kifleyesus (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Woldeslelassie ( Re'se reusan Woldselassie the great)
Be'al Gada Debbeb (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Minasse (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Sibhatu (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Araya (Ras)
Be'al Gada Abraha (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Tedla (Aba Guben) (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Weres (Dej.)
Be'al Gada Kahsa (Dej.)
Brother deceitful, there is nothing to defend, you have been exposed over and over. These areas were not stolen from Tigray in the 1940s as EPRDF and yourself have claimed as shown by maps drawn by neutral bodies, foreign countries who have no tendencies towards Tigray or Gonder. They are neutral. More maps will be posted as soon as I get hold of them. :mrgreen:

Dejach Aklilu
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 14:41

Halafi Mengedi wrote: Ye Mayafr Leba,

How long did take you to photo shop the map???
Your fathers took them fater time to loot Tigray lands than to photo shop your wishful lands.

What the hell were your fathers thinking to name Tigrigna name of Adi Arkay and Mai Xebri to the region they do not understand one word of Tigrigna???

Did Aba Dula teach you any 'Gebre gebnet at all when you were youth???
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: I sense anger in your tone. Come down and address the evidence presented.

Dejazmch of Tigrai
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejazmch of Tigrai » 26 Oct 2013, 14:45

What I don't understand is why the Gonderes particularly are always after tigrian territories no matter how much they hold they still want to steal every piece of our territory. Remember tigrins sacrificed for the defense of your metema territories yet, as a thank you, you keep stealing and you keep undermining our territory in every opportunity that comes to you. Shame on you 10 aleka Akililu

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 14:49

Map 4: This is a map drawn in 1890. Who drew it is not shown, but is likely to be the British. It shows the territory called Tigre is clearly found confined to the east of River Tekeze. So the areas beyond the River, to the west were not part of the Tigre province.

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 14:54

Map 5: This map is an Italian drawn map in 1881. It clearly shows once again, the province of Tigre, was bound by River Tekeze. It did not include lands to the west of the river.

Image

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejach Aklilu » 26 Oct 2013, 15:02

Map 6: This is a map either drawn by the Dutch or the Germans. It shows the province of Tigrie to the east of River Tekeze. This map also shows clearly Walkait tot he west of the River Tekeze, outside of the province of Tigrie.

Image
Last edited by Dejach Aklilu on 28 Apr 2014, 13:20, edited 1 time in total.

CDE
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by CDE » 26 Oct 2013, 15:06

Brother Aklilu,
Didn't know you were a librarian. 8) 8) 8)

Dejazmch of Tigrai
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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Dejazmch of Tigrai » 26 Oct 2013, 15:09

There is no line that separates tigray from amhara province, the line is not drawn to indicate the boundary but a geographical landscape. If you check antalo there is nothing that seperates it going all the way south ward to as far as lasta, thus if we go by your assumption, the entire lasta and angot in 1881 were part of Enderta.
Dejach Aklilu wrote:Map 5: This map is an Italian drawn map in 1881. It clearly shows once again, the province of Tigre, was bound by River Tekeze. It did not include lands to the west of the river.

Image

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Re: Welkait Tsegede part of historical Tigray or Gonder? let the maps talk

Post by Zack » 26 Oct 2013, 15:14

Dejach Aklilu wrote:Map 6: This is a map either drawn by the Dutch or the Germans. It shows the province of Tigrie to the west of River Tekeze. This map also shows clearly Walkait tot he west of the River Tekeze, outside of the province of Tigrie.

Image

Dejach Aklilu when was this map drawn it is a very interesting map, this map is very clear it even mentions the isas in the east. We are waiting for Dejzamch of Tigrai and his rebuttal. I am sure he cant blame these maps on the mehel sefaris and that they must've had a hand to it. These maps were drawn most likely the last few u posted during King Yohannes reign. Who was seated on the Foreign affairs ministry during that time?

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