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Temt
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by Temt » 05 Sep 2020, 17:51

DefendTheTruth wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 16:48
Asmara wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 16:12
DefendTheTruth wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 14:39
My Eritrean brothers, okay brother is a problem according to some of the content of this thread, then friends,

It is not my business to decide on or even comment on the will of the Eritrean people but still wounder just to know what could be wrong if we say we like you, we don't like to let you go, because we consider you our part?

If we got united then we will get, granted, stronger than we are on ourselves individually. ድር ስያብር አንበሳ ያስር። goes a saying in Amharic.

The union should be based on a mutual benefit and mutual respect, not on one side taken advantage of, subjugated or made disadvantaged.

If we are united, then you can drink our coffee as yours and we can use your port as ours, what is wrong with that? I am just trying to understand your logic.

We have a shared history and I tend to believe that we will going to have the same (shared) destiny as well. The current world order requires to be strong to remain competitive.

It is not my business to discuss but that doesn't (necessarily) mean it doesn't concern me (because of the shared history and destiny), just to make myself more clear here.
Before I answer your question I would like to ask you this:
Let's say you ask the same question to Somalis..."If we got united then we will get, granted, stronger than we are on ourselves individually.
....If we are united, then you can drink our coffee as yours and we can use your port as ours, what is wrong with that? I am just trying to understand your logic."
What would Somalis say to you?

Now to answer your question...

Eritrea has never been part of Ethiopia. I don't need to lecture you history how Eritrea changed hands between Italy, British and finally fell at the hands of Haile Selalsie. Subsequently, We paid dearly to reverse this injustice and finally thanks to EPLF we got our independence. If we were willing to unite with Ethiopia we wouldn't have sacrificed tens of thousands of our compatriots. Keep your coffee and we keep our country and its ports. You will never find a single Eritrean who would entertain unity with mama Ethiopia. Lets live in peace as good neighbours.
I hope now you understand where we are coming from and appreciate our psyche at the same time.
I am not a historian, like you said, but I have read and heard multiple claims from Eritreans themselves that they are the descendants of the Axumite Kingdom and many others told me that Eritrea claimed its independence from Ethiopia based on its very short history of about 60 years, when it fell under domination of foreign powers, probably Italy, if I remember correctly.

Is something wrong in this view?

After saying that I do wish that all the HoA countries get united and be strong for the challenges of the day and the future in fact.

If you are basing your rejection to accept my suggestion on the fact that Eritrea has paid a heavy sacrifice to get its independence, so did Ethiopia as well to keep its national integrity and sovereignty over what once used to be part of its soverign territory.

I have many family members and friends who were lost in Eritrea to defend their fatherland and we didn't find and don't know their final resting place upto this day.

But my question was not about reckoning of our respective loses here, rather if it is not more rational if we get united based on the free will of the two people? Please understand the difference here.
DefendTheTruth,
I have no doubt that you may have heard the skewed "History" of Eritrea usually told or authored by some Ethiopians and Ethiophiles. Sadly, twisting the truth, in a futile attempt, to achieve one's wishes is called "Subterfuge". But the reality is Eritrea was never part of present-day Ethiopia, except for the short period from November 14, 1962 (to May 24, 1991), at which time your King Haileselassie illegally and forcefully annexed Eritrea as the 14th province of Ethiopia. In fact, no reputable maps showed Eritrea as part of Ethiopia during the long period of the Turkish, Egyptian, Italian, or British administrations.
That being the history, do you care to enlighten us why is it Ethiopians shamelessly place such claiming such outrageous claims against Eritrea when they never have placed such claims against Djibouti if you are going to go to history? My friend the Sweedish and Norway, the Finish and Danish, the US and Canada, etc share many common things and history amongst them, but they remain sovereign countries.
You said, if we are united what is yours would be ours and what is ours would be yours. That is wonderful. But that is called cooperation which could be achieved by agreement and trade policy as two soverign nations.

tlel
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Posts: 1559
Joined: 28 Dec 2019, 14:24

Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by tlel » 05 Sep 2020, 18:43

Aurorae wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 17:37
Tiel,

Abbiy pretended to be a peace loving, far sighted individual. Now, watch the mask dropping out of his face. He is about power. But, I could also be wrong. Time will tell. I can tell you this again. Ethnic federalism is here to stay unless you are looking forward for Rwanda 2. The Oromos have had it. The stupid weyanes spoiled it for them. So called one of their own may let them down too. :evil: I don't care about the opportunistic Weyanes. You have a beef with them, you know where to find them. Sending back Ethiopia to 1974 won't work. Respect each other and lift the country toward its potential.
Aurorae, also Italian Shabo,

That IS what your goal is so that Eritrea can devour Ethiopia. Of course, it is you Shabos who formed ethnic rule, I wouldn't expect you to say anything else

DefendTheTruth
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by DefendTheTruth » 06 Sep 2020, 13:07

Temt wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 17:51

DefendTheTruth,
I have no doubt that you may have heard the skewed "History" of Eritrea usually told or authored by some Ethiopians and Ethiophiles. Sadly, twisting the truth, in a futile attempt, to achieve one's wishes is called "Subterfuge". But the reality is Eritrea was never part of present-day Ethiopia, except for the short period from November 14, 1962 (to May 24, 1991), at which time your King Haileselassie illegally and forcefully annexed Eritrea as the 14th province of Ethiopia. In fact, no reputable maps showed Eritrea as part of Ethiopia during the long period of the Turkish, Egyptian, Italian, or British administrations.
That being the history, do you care to enlighten us why is it Ethiopians shamelessly place such claiming such outrageous claims against Eritrea when they never have placed such claims against Djibouti if you are going to go to history? My friend the Sweedish and Norway, the Finish and Danish, the US and Canada, etc share many common things and history amongst them, but they remain sovereign countries.
You said, if we are united what is yours would be ours and what is ours would be yours. That is wonderful. But that is called cooperation which could be achieved by agreement and trade policy as two soverign nations.
Like I said before, I see things not from the historical point of view but from the practicality and current day value point of view and in that view I still tend to believe that it would be more favorable for both sides if they can reconcile their differences and come together to be more competitive for the challenges ahead.

I am not sure if I understand you well, when you say "Eritrea was never part of present-day Ethiopia" and what that present day Ethiopia looks like. When was present day Ethiopia created and how long is that in comparison to the over all existence of these two ancient and proud nations of the Horn of Africa?

Could you compare the total length of their history and the history of the present day of Ethiopia?

I am not a historian but still my feeling is that many nations around the world, including some of the powerful nations of today, had their national boundaries constantly moving around and they have never been stiff demarcation all along.

Nations persisted, boundaries kept moving and changing all along, if may summerize so.

Yes the most important thing is to cooperate and that is why I raised this issue, but in the face of many competitors the prospect of cooperation keeps elusive, unfortunately.

To guarantee that cooperation, bring the cooperating parties better under the same umbrella and you are on the safe side, I felt.

Abere
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by Abere » 06 Sep 2020, 13:30

ይህ ጥያቄ በደንብ ተብራርቶ Articulated ቢቀርብ። እንዲህ በሚል ለምን ኢትዮጵያኖች በተለይም አማራዎች በፊት የወያኔን አሁን ደግሞ የዐበይ አህመድን አካሄድ ይቃወማሉ በሚል። እንድህ በሚል ከተስተካከለ ደግሞ
--- የሚቃወሙበት ደግሞ ወያኔ ትግሬ ዐብይ ደግሞ ኦሮሞ ስለሆነ አይደለም። ዐብይ ሆነ ወያኔ አንድ አይነት መርህ ላይ የተቸከሉ ወይም ምህልቃቸውን ያሳረፉት በጎሣ ድንኳን ላይ ስለሆነ። ወይም ምንም ዓይነት ለውጥ ለአገሪቱ ስላላመጣ። በእውነት እንነጋገር ካልን ዐብይ አህመድ ለኤርትራ እንጅ ለኢትዮጵያዊያን ለውጥ አላመጣም። የእስረኞች መፈታት ለውጥ ከሆነ ስህተት ነው። ሰዎቹ ተፈቱ እንጅ አገራዊ ጉዳያቸው ገና እሥር ቤት ነው። እንዳውም እንዴ እነ ሰክንድር ነጋ ያሉት ዐርበኞች ተመልሰው እሥር ቤት ናቸው። ሌላው በዐብይ አህመድ ዘመን ገሃድ የወጣው ከአሥመራ ተለቅቆ የመጣው ኦነግ ዐይን ባወጣ መልኩ በአማራ ላይ የመንግስት ድጋፍ ተደርጎለት ግልፅ የዘር ማጥፋት ወንጀል በሰፊው መካሄዱ። በዚህ ሁኔታ እንዴት ነው አማራ ለዐብይ ድጋፉን የሚለግሰው። በጣም የሚገርመው ዐብይ የሰላም ተምሳሌት እና አርዕያ መሆን ሲገባው እራሱ ጥል ፈጣሪ ነው። ትዝ ይለኛል በአንድ ወቅት ዐብይ ለደሴ ከተማ ነዋሪዎች የተናገረው አማራ እና ትግሬ ማጋጨት ነበር እርሱም ዐፄ ዮሀንስ ወሎን አስገድደው ክርስቲያን በማድረጋቸው ምክንያት ተሰድደው ብዙዎቹ ጅማ በሻሻ አሉ ሲል። ይኸ የተጋነነ አነጋገር ነው። አስገድዶ የሚለው እራሱ አከራካሪ ነው። የፓለቲካ ቃል ነው። በዚህ ብሎ ተሰድዶ ጅማ የሄድ አንድም የወሎ አማራ የለም። ዘወር ብሎ ደግሞ የልማት ጥያቄ ሲያቀርቡለት እንዴት አማራ ክልልን እናልማ የተሰጣቸውን በጄት የክልል ልዩ ኃይል ወታደር እያስለጠኑበት አላቸው። በሳምንቱ ይመስለኛል የአማራ ህዝብ መርዶውን ሰማ - በርካታ የአማራ አመራሮች እንዴ እነ አሳምነው ፅጌ ያሉት ተለቃቅመው ተገድለዋል። እሽ፣ እንዴት አድርጎ አማራ ዐብይን ይቀበለው። የአዲስ አበባ ህዝብ ከዕለት ጉርሱ ቀንሶ አስቀምጦ የሰራው ጎጆው ከአሩሲ እና ባሌ ምንም ሳይለፉ ዐብይ አህመድ ተረኛ ኦሮሞ ስለሆነ ብቻ ተቀምተዋል። እሽ፣ ዐብይ አህመድ ምን ለውጥ አመጣ ለአማራ ዎይም ለኢትዮጵያዊያን። ውድ ኢርትራዊያን ለእናንተ ስለጣማችሁ ለእኛ ይጥመናል ማለት አይደለም። ሰለም በማገኘታችሁ ደስ ቢለንም እኛ ግን ከ50 ዓመታት በላይ ሰላም አጥተናል። የሰው ልጆች በታች ጭራ በቀረ የጎሳ እና የዘር ዕልቂት ውስጥ ነን ትንሽ እረፍት እንፈልጋለን። በወያኔም አሁንም በዐብይ ኦነግ አብረን ነን።

tlel
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by tlel » 06 Sep 2020, 13:36

Aurorae wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 17:37
Tiel,

Abbiy pretended to be a peace loving, far sighted individual. Now, watch the mask dropping out of his face. He is about power. But, I could also be wrong. Time will tell. I can tell you this again. Ethnic federalism is here to stay unless you are looking forward for Rwanda 2. The Oromos have had it. The stupid weyanes spoiled it for them. So called one of their own may let them down too. :evil: I don't care about the opportunistic Weyanes. You have a beef with them, you know where to find them. Sending back Ethiopia to 1974 won't work. Respect each other and lift the country toward its potential.
Is Dr Aby Eritrean leader or Ethiopian leader? His priotiry is for his country just like you bark on ER 24/7 for ERitrea. When do you stop talking about Ethiopia who are you to decided ethnic federalism is the way to go for Ethiopia? Of course you want Ethiopia that kills eachother because of ethnicity, your boss Isayas is the one who created this. You should read the behavior of Isayas from the book Assefa Chabo whom Isayas had killed because Isayas was the architect to demise Ethiopia with his foreign elements.

tlel
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by tlel » 06 Sep 2020, 14:43

ኣበረ ብዙ ኢትዮዽያውያን ያው የውስጥ በዘር የተደራጀውን እንጂ ቢሞቱ ፈርተው ለውጪ ኣገራት ኢትዮዽያን ለማፈራረስ የሚሞክረውን ኢትዮዽያዊው ተሽሽጎ እየኖረ ነው። ኣሁን በቅርቡ እንኳን ኢትዮዽያን በኣባይ ምክንያት ለመሸጥ ፪ 0 የኣሜሪካ ሰነተሮች ለ ትራምፕ ፈርመዋል፣ ይኸውም ወዳጅ ከሚባሉት ትንሻ ኣገር ተወካዮች። የኣማራውን መሪዎችን ያስገደሉትም እነሱ ናቸው እኮ ተብለዋል በህዋሃትና እዛ ኣገራቸው ወስደው ኣንጎላቸውን ኣጥበው የቀየሯቸውን ኢትዮዽያውያኖች። ኣገሪቱ በእነዚህ ወዳጅ መስለው ጠላት ፈረንጆች ኣገራችን ለማፍረስ ዶር ኣብይ እየጣረ ነው። ደሞ በህዋሃት ግዜ ያደራጁትን ጸረ ኢትዮጵያዊነት፣ ኢትዮዽያውያኖች እስከ መስዋዕትነት ለውጭ ኣገራት መናገርና መንቀሳቀስ ኣለባቸው ከመዘግየቱ በፊት። ልክ ህዋህትን ሻብያን እንዳስመሰረቱ፣ ኣማራውን በማታለል ላይ ናቸው ግን እነሱ ላይ ነው ጥቃቱ። ኣብዛኛው ኣማራው ያልፋል ወይም ወዳጅ ነን በለው ቁጭ ብለዋል፣ ስልጣኑንም ነጥቀው እንዲሰጧቸው እየጠበቁ ነው በጎን ደሞ ኢትዮዽያውያኑን ወዳገራቸው እየወሰዱ ያሉት፣ እነሱን መተው ኢትዮዽያን ለመያዝና ኣባይ ወንዝን በቁጥጥር ስር ለማድረግ ነው። ንቃ ኣታለቃቅስ።

tlel
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Re: Why are some Amhara activists hell-bent on destroying Ethiopia

Post by tlel » 06 Sep 2020, 14:53

tlel wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 14:43
tlel wrote:
06 Sep 2020, 14:43
Aurorae wrote:
05 Sep 2020, 17:37
Tiel,

Abbiy pretended to be a peace loving, far sighted individual. Now, watch the mask dropping out of his face. He is about power. But, I could also be wrong. Time will tell. I can tell you this again. Ethnic federalism is here to stay unless you are looking forward for Rwanda 2. The Oromos have had it. The stupid weyanes spoiled it for them. So called one of their own may let them down too. :evil: I don't care about the opportunistic Weyanes. You have a beef with them, you know where to find them. Sending back Ethiopia to 1974 won't work. Respect each other and lift the country toward its potential.
ኣበረ ብዙ ኢትዮዽያውያን ያው የውስጥ በዘር የተደራጀውን እንጂ ቢሞቱ ፈርተው ለውጪ ኣገራት ኢትዮዽያን ለማፈራረስ የሚሞክረውን ኢትዮዽያዊው ተሽሽጎ እየኖረ ነው። ኣሁን በቅርቡ እንኳን ኢትዮዽያን በኣባይ ምክንያት ለመሸጥ ፪ 0 የኣሜሪካ ሰነተሮች ለ ትራምፕ ፈርመዋል፣ ይኸውም ወዳጅ ከሚባሉት ትንሻ ኣገር ተወካዮች። የኣማራውን መሪዎችን ያስገደሉትም እነሱ ናቸው እኮ ተብለዋል በህዋሃትና እዛ ኣገራቸው ወስደው ኣንጎላቸውን ኣጥበው የቀየሯቸውን ኢትዮዽያውያኖች። ኣገሪቱ በእነዚህ ወዳጅ መስለው ጠላት ፈረንጆች ኣገራችን ለማፍረስ ዶር ኣብይ እየጣረ ነው። ደሞ በህዋሃት ግዜ ያደራጁትን ጸረ ኢትዮጵያዊነት፣ ኢትዮዽያውያኖች እስከ መስዋዕትነት ለውጭ ኣገራት መናገርና መንቀሳቀስ ኣለባቸው ከመዘግየቱ በፊት። ልክ ህዋህትን ሻብያን እንዳስመሰረቱ፣ ኣማራውን በማታለል ላይ ናቸው ግን እነሱ ላይ ነው ጥቃቱ። ኣብዛኛው ኣማራው ያልፋል ወይም ወዳጅ ነን በለው ቁጭ ብለዋል፣ ስልጣኑንም ነጥቀው እንዲሰጧቸው እየጠበቁ ነው በጎን ደሞ ኢትዮዽያውያኑን ወዳገራቸው እየወሰዱ ያሉት፣ እነሱን መተው ኢትዮዽያን ለመያዝና ኣባይ ወንዝን በቁጥጥር ስር ለማድረግ ነው። ንቃ ኣታለቃቅስ።

በየኣገራቱ ኢትዮዽያው ተድራጅቶ ሆይ ማለት ኣለበት። ኣሁን በህዋሃት፣ ሻብያና ኦነግ ሞክረዋል፣ ኣሁን ቀጥታ እየመጡ ነው።

ለኣረብ ኣገራትም ኢትዮዽያ ላይ ጫና እንዲፈጥሩ እየተነገራቸው ነው። ዋናው ጋር ካልሄድክ ወይም፣ ነፃውጪዎችን ካላስወገድክ ኢትዮዽያ ኣሁንም ኣደጋ ላይ ነች። ኣለበለዚያ ወዳጄ ነች በምትለው ኣገር ባርነትን ተቀብለህ ኑር እንኳን ኣባይን ልትጠብቅ ቀርቶ

እዛች ኣገር የሚኖሩ የተውለዱ ኢትዮዽያውያን፣ ኣገሪቱ ኣንጎላቸውን ኣጥበው በተለይ እዛ የተወለደው የሃስት ትርክት እንደ ህዋሃት ኣስፋፍተው ትውልዱን የኣገሪቱን የወታደር ልብስ ኣስለብሰው ሄዳቸው ኢትዮዽያን ውጉ፣ ተቆጣጠሩ ታዘዋል። በተለይ ኣማራ ክልል ውስጥ። ስንት ምስኪን ኢትዮዽያውያን እዛ የሄደውም ሆነ የተውለደው ለነሱ ጦርነት የሚመለመለው የሚሞተው ብዙ ነው። የበታች ሆነው የሚኖሩትም እነዚሁ ማንነታቸውን የተቀየረባቸው ኢትዮዽያውያኖች ናቸው።

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